Rick Moquin

FWIW planting them out in sand will greatly assist you when you will plant them out in proper soil at a later date. The soil (sand) will not stick to the roots like peat will, and as we know, we don't want peat in any of our soil.

JB,

I can't help but notice (from your posts) that you are full of enthusiasm and are approaching this hobby from several directions in helter skelter sort of fashion so to speak. This is not uncommon in the beginning but it is far more useful to stick to the basics in the beginning then going all over the place mis-informed. Not that the information provided is not good information, I think you are not allowing some of this stuff to soak in, before heading in a different direction.

The following article was written sometime ago. It is a compendium of links for all you need to know and then some. I recommend you bookmark the page and return to it often. Although, I am the author, I see myself returning to it on occasion to look up a specific link.

__________________
Bonsai is the journey, not the destination
Bonsai Wonders

Rick Moquin

Turface is a little too large, but the fines you sift and are totally useless for bonsai potting medium (with the exceptions of mame) is excellent for this purpose. When Japanese talk sand, we need to remember they are not talking beach sand, but something coarser, along the lines of sifted turface.

__________________
Bonsai is the journey, not the destination
Bonsai Wonders

Prowler

Rick
Not to get off on J-Bs thread but i find Scots pines that look very nice indeed, but when i clear around them, they have a trunk with nothing growing on them, they have simply grown in long grass or whatever, this is the same as Horse Chestnuts they simply fall on the ground, then the leaves from the tree cover them up, then they grow a long tap root, once that happens they start to grow the top part.
If you sit back and think about it, not a lot of seeds get buried in soil, so maybe this is where we go wrong, something to think about. Cheers.

__________________
Its hell out there, give them hell back.

Rick Moquin

I hear you Scotty and mother nature does indeed know how to sow seeds. Us humans on the other hand need a more practical approach IMO. If these seedlings are indeed intended for bonsai, then IMO plant them out in a substrate that will be easily removed later on.

The major problems that cause root rot in nursery stock once planted out in bonsai soil, usually occurs where the old soil was not completely cleared out and hence has become compacted over time, does not drain well and is inadequate of providing oxygenation to the roots. Although I mentioned nursery stock, the same can occur with an established bonsai if old soil is not completely removed during subsequent re-potting, this is well documented.

__________________
Bonsai is the journey, not the destination
Bonsai Wonders

J-Bog

I don't mean to seem over zealous and I don't mean to pester people with so many questions I just really enjoy bonsai. I have only three trees and I really want to expand my collection and sadly there are no nurserys that cater to bonsai or even have an decent variety of trees, around here everyone is all about seasonal flowers and bulbs (ick) as far as trees go around here for sale it is only sugar maples and various kinds of evergreens. So Seed is the only really viable option for me.

__________________
"It is said that you should never leave anything to chance; but, in operating like that, chance never leaves anything to you."

Brent

I recommend planting seeds in flats as opposed to planting in pots or peat pots or pellets. Having done both (flats and pots), I discovered that you get a better root network from flats, even when planting very densely as I do. For example, I will plant hundreds of Acer palmatum seeds in a 17x 17x 2 inch flat yielding 150 or more trees.

The roots grow into each other, but there are no walls (for most of them), so the roots are straight. If you use a loose mix, such as sand or bark/perlite (my mix), the seedlings easily come apart and the roots can be trimmed to fit the pot at transplanting. This yields an excellent start on the nebari. The only drawback is that this transplanting must take place in winter when the trees are dormant. That's not a problem for me since I not only keep the seedlings in the flat all season and all winter, but actually store seedlings in the flat for up to 3 years, using them as needed.

In contrast, seeds planted in pots or cell flats or other containers produce roots that quickly hit the walls and then turn downward, inward, and even upward in a tangled mess. If you are dealing with tomato plants this doesn't matter and it makes transplantation really easy. But for bonsai, this is a nightmare. Each little seedling will require several minutes of brutal manipulation to get the roots straight and a lot of damage will result. I buy some seedlings in peat 'plugs'. I get them when dormant and the first thing I do is comb out all the peat, wash them and carefully straighten those surface roots before potting them up. They are dormant when I do this, so most survive the process, but dealing with seedings from flats or field grown seedlings is much easier.

Brent
EvergreenGardenworks.com
see our blog at http://BonsaiNurseryman.typepad.com

AlainK

Judging by the info on this site (http://www.fs.fed.us/ipnf/eco/yourfo...ees/index.html), there are several native species that can be worked as bonsai : tamarack, several species of pines, pacific yew, etc.
I'm pretty sure there must be tree nurseries where you can find saplings or potted trees that you can use...

But growing trees from seeds is an interesting and sometimes rewarding experience : I happen to live in a region with hundreds of different species that you can get from tree nuseries or garden centers, and I often collect seeds on trees in autumn. This year, I've planted seeds from Amur maples and different kinds of Japanese maples.

The result is highly variable, cultivars cross-breed or come back to the type species, and the percentage of success varies a lot too (from 0% to 50%), but it's part of the fun, and it's cheap.

I put them in large pots with a layer of 3-5 mm lava rock at the bottom, but I put the seeds themselves on a layer of river sand, as suggested before.

Try larches, I've had good results with them, and they're easy to work with.

__________________
Alain K.
http://www.rdb45.fr
http://ak2.apinc.org/bdB

Kansai

That might change in a couple of months. All the nurseries in my area have closed out or put away most of their stock for the winter.

DR

__________________
Bonsai is easy! All you have to do is stare at a little tree until drops of blood form on your forehead.--paraphrased from Gene Fowler

centaura

Start looking around April or May, and try Cloverdale's. Ask them if they start their own trees, and if they do can you look through their young stock which might not be in an area regularily visited by customers. There's a nursery up in MI that I've been to that starts a lot of its own trees, and all the state's bonsai clubs come rummaging through looking for stock. Ask if they have a reject pile - a great place to look for stuff. Things that are not appropriate for landscapes can be great bonsai. Also look through the shrubs. That's where you can find some really interesting stuff. While its not been grown as pre-bonsai material, shrubs like boxwoods are great places to start.

Another resource is your local bonsai club - http://www.boisebonsai.com/ - they're going to be hosting the ABS annual Learning Seminar in 2009. They can tell you where they shop, and they might have nursery field trips that they host.

-Centaura

J-Bog

I will send them an email about where they get their trees but last time I sent them an email they wanted me to pay dues and join.

__________________
"It is said that you should never leave anything to chance; but, in operating like that, chance never leaves anything to you."