treebeard55

Hello, all,

I’ve posted this picture of a JBP before. This time the lines and arrows are different, because I have a different question.

Most of this tree is sacrifice. Sooner or later I plan to chop the trunk off, at or near the red line in the pic. One or both of the two small shoots near the base (black arrow) will be used to “build” the final tree.

My question is, is “sooner” better than “later?”

Plan A is to make that trunk chop next spring. (I might leave a stump to be jinned.) Those two small shoots would be developed into the new trunkline and the first major branch.

Plan B is to remove the upper part in stages over several years. I would take off two or three of the upper branches next spring, and remove one of the two smaller shoots, so as not to get a bulge in the trunk. (The first faint signs of a bulge can be seen now, if you look closely.) The other small shoot would become the foundation for the rest of the eventual bonsai. Over the next couple of years I would keep removing the upper branches, two or three at a time, until eventually I chopped off the upper trunk at or near the red line.

A bit of the tree’s history: it was field-grown for three years from a seedling, about 30 miles from where I live. In May it was dug and potted temporarily in field soil. I bought it a few weeks later, and it spent about 6 weeks, total, in the field soil before being repotted into my own growing pot and mix. It has grown well over the summer – in spite of the trauma of two repottings it has lived up to the JBP’s reputation for vigorous growth. It will soon go into “cold storage” for the winter.

(An interesting side note: JBP’s are right on the knife-edge of cold-hardiness here. They overwinter OK in the ground, but in a pot need some extra protection.)

So here’s my question. Would Plan A be too much trauma? You can see from the pic that if I went that route, I’d be taking off about 90% of the tree’s foliage at one stroke. Can even a JBP take that kind of abuse? Or is Plan B the only good route if I want to keep my tree?

Comments, advice, questions and (especially) relevant stories of your own experience are all welcome. I’m a latecomer to Japanese black pine culture, so will be glad for any input from those with more experience with this species. Thanks!

Attached Images

Large JBP plan_edited-2.jpg (88.1 KB, 44 views)

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Treebeard 55

Christmas -- the prequel to Easter.

andrew

Treebeard,

Im down in Dayton. I have two similar sized and shaped JBP. Im wanting to do a similar chop, but I think I would wait longer than next spring and let that branch get stronger. I took one today and planted it in the ground, the other Im going to replant in a big pond basket in the spring. From what ive read the chop would be ok, but it needs to be stronger first. andy

anttal63

my take would be to chop it in the hope of poppn low buds to sacrifice and fatten the base and lower trunk. let the new leader run as well. should be no prob if the tree is healthy. now all that is variable according to size and styling. but for me this tree still needs alot of growing.

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noissee

it looks like you have too much foliage in the top. i would take off all but one or two branches in the top so more energy is given to the lower parts. then leave that for another year. chop the spring after, hope for low buds, and repeat the process.

bonsaikc

I agree that you should do this in stages. I think your proposed new leader is fine but not strong enough to survive a chop like that. How long were the candles this year? If they were small and delicate, the tree is too weak. Take off about 2/3 of the upper part of the tree and wait for the low growth to get stronger before you remove the whole thing.

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anttal63

sound advice from chris and most likely more accurate for your climate. i must learn to not take for granted my climate here.

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treebeard55

Thanks, everyone, for your feedback so far. Yes, this tree's just getting started; I anticipate 3-5 years before I start any real shaping.

To answer one question, the candles were healthy and numerous; decent in size, but not huge.

More feedback is welcome, if anyone wants to offer more.

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Treebeard 55

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treebeard55

I decided to go with Plan B; more gradual, but less risk to the tree.

So, before I put the tree into a coldroom for the winter, I lopped off two of the upper branches (red arrow and white lines.)

The two lower shoots (black arrow) were both cut back to the beginning of ‘08’s growth, to force compactness. For the moment they’re both still there; once I see which one grows more vigorously next spring, I’ll remove the other.

Nothing has happened yet at the red cross-trunk line, and nothing will for several more years.

Thanks to all of you who offered feedback on my question. I’ll try to post a picture every year or so, so people can see how the tree develops.

Attached Images

Large JBP plan_edited-2.jpg (88.8 KB, 11 views)

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Treebeard 55

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AlainK

I think you were quite right.

But why put it in a coldroom?

Pines can stand temperatures well below 15° Celsius. If it's been repotted recently, an extra protection would be to bury it into the ground to the base of the trunk and add some leaves or straw to the first branches (10-15 cm is enough)


Aye.

If i were you, I'd wrap the trunk with raffia, wire it and give it some movement until you hear "krak!"...

Then transpot it in a much wider container : if you are ready to consider the work in terms of years, then I'm conviced that this kind of otpion is worth doing.

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Alain K.
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treebeard55

Hi, Alain,

Why the coldroom? Our winters in this part of North America are a good deal colder than in the tree's native habitat. I think you meant to say that JBP's can take temps down to -15 C (not to 15 C,) and I'm sure you're right. But for us, a "typical" winter (if there is such a thing) means that at least once we get an overnite low of -29 C.

JBP is right on the knife's edge of cold hardiness here. It survives OK in the ground; the friend from whom I bought this tree has in-ground specimens at least 20 years old. But in a pot, it needs special protection, beyond normal bonsai winter care. I use a coldroom for JBP and a few other species that are half-hardy here.

As for the raffia and movement ... the trunk already has a little, and I'm planning a final height of at least half a meter. But I just may take your advice on that; I'm thinking about it.

And as for repotting: it went thru two repottings in '08, about six weeks apart. I plan to leave the roots alone for a year or two.

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Treebeard 55

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