Black Pine Candles

Dav4 · 05-08-2009, 07:48 AM

[quote=Ml_work;6936]Dave, are you asking about the next to last pic in the second post? I will get some closeup of the nebari.

Yes, Micheal, that's the angle that seems the most pleasing to me. Feel free to posts pics of the nebari from all the angles, including the one we're discussing. My thought is to pull down the first large branch on the right, making it the primary branch, and have the apex move up and off toward the left, assuming there is an appropriate branch there. Just so you know, I never feel truly comfortable making styling decisions based on pictures alone. I need to pick my way through the canopy and view the nebari and trunk line at the same time before I start chopping off branches. There is always a best front to start with, but you are the one who is most likely to see it.

Dave

I just took another look...that branch seems to only have needles out toward the end. If there are still some needles closer to the trunk, you will hopefully get some back budding this year with some aggressive thinning and pruning.

bonsaikc · 05-08-2009, 05:55 PM

When I suggested you thin it out, I did not mean removing major branches, only getting rid of some old needles and reducing branching to only two shoots per internode. You will find you get a much better idea of the tree when you can see through it.

chris

emorrin · 05-09-2009, 01:24 AM

I find this technique you are explaining rather different then what I have seen. How long have you been growing your pines with this method? I am still trying to figure out which method is best for me. I just started really getting interested in pines last year. I have been following Steve Pilacek's techniques for Japanese Black Pines and Vance Wood for Mugo Pines. There are so many techniques, it makes my head spin...

I too like to fertilize heavily with organics. I use chicken manure, fish emulsion, make my own cakes how you mentioned, use liquid seaweed, humic acid, inoculate with mycorrhizal spores, make my own compost tea, etc. I do not use any synthetic fertilizers because I believe the salts kill off the beneficial bacteria/organisms. I may be incorrect with this theory but until someone proves me wrong ....

I grow in my Japanese Black Pine in a mainly inorganic mix in a pond basket. I mainly use Turface and volcanic rock with about 10% aged pine bark. I use the same mix for my Mugos. I have also started several Austrian Pine and Scotch Pines from seed this year.

Enough with my rant, I am still trying to figure out which method is best for me. This will be one I will have to give a try. Do you have any additional info regarding this technique?

Ml_work · 05-12-2009, 01:08 AM

emorrin.....I hope you are not asking me...I am just the "grasshopper" in this class.

Have a Great Day!
Michael

bonsaikc · 05-12-2009, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emorrin

I find this technique you are explaining rather different then what I have seen. How long have you been growing your pines with this method? I am still trying to figure out which method is best for me. I just started really getting interested in pines last year. I have been following Steve Pilacek's techniques for Japanese Black Pines and Vance Wood for Mugo Pines. There are so many techniques, it makes my head spin...

I too like to fertilize heavily with organics. I use chicken manure, fish emulsion, make my own cakes how you mentioned, use liquid seaweed, humic acid, inoculate with mycorrhizal spores, make my own compost tea, etc. I do not use any synthetic fertilizers because I believe the salts kill off the beneficial bacteria/organisms. I may be incorrect with this theory but until someone proves me wrong ....

I grow in my Japanese Black Pine in a mainly inorganic mix in a pond basket. I mainly use Turface and volcanic rock with about 10% aged pine bark. I use the same mix for my Mugos. I have also started several Austrian Pine and Scotch Pines from seed this year.

Enough with my rant, I am still trying to figure out which method is best for me. This will be one I will have to give a try. Do you have any additional info regarding this technique?

Emorrin,
Good questions. I have only been using this method a short time. It is the method I learned from Boon Manakitivipart and which he has been using for several years. It's quite new. I don't believe he developed it, it was developed by his sensei in Japan. The other methods you mentioned are more old school and have given rise to the myth that pines are very slow to develop. They need not be.

Sounds like you are on the right track with your growing methods. If you'd like to post a photo of a couple of your trees, I'd love to see them.

Chris

emorrin · 05-12-2009, 02:03 PM

Here is my Japanese Black Pine 'Thunderhead'. It is currently approximately a foot high. I plan on it being of shohin size so most of the upper branches will be sacrificial ones. After needle plucking last fall, it back budded all over the place. I removed all but 2 buds on the upper branches in early spring and left all the lower buds alone. Those lower buds will be my future branches.

In addition to that, I have 2 mugo pines that still look like bushes. I bought them from Lowes last year and am slowly working on them. I am following Vance Wood's reccomendations on those. I also have a 3 year old Pinus Nigra I collected before I knew what I was doing. Not sure if it will ever amount to anything but it is a good learning exeprience. I also am growing about 50 Pinus Nigra and 50 Scotch Pines from seed this year. They have a couple of weeks before I cut the tap root on them. I plan on using different techniques with batches of these seedlings. I am still trying to figure out which technique will work best for me. I guess the only way to do that is to try them all out.

Ml_work · 07-04-2009, 12:55 PM

Chris,

Quote:"For the record, I candle my trees the first week of July"

I realize you may be plucking your pine candles, cooking a pig and shooting FireWorks today. But if you happen to check in maybe you can give me the OK. I let the candles grow on my pine and as I look back at the pics I see it has filled in more that I thought. I am correct that I should now cut the tall candles all the way back, and any others that I feel are too tall? I will get the the needle pulling next...
Thanks,
Have a Great 4th!
Michael

05-08-2009, 07:48 AM	#21 (permalink)
Dav4 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: SE Massachusetts Posts: 93	[quote=Ml_work;6936]Dave, are you asking about the next to last pic in the second post? I will get some closeup of the nebari. Yes, Micheal, that's the angle that seems the most pleasing to me. Feel free to posts pics of the nebari from all the angles, including the one we're discussing. My thought is to pull down the first large branch on the right, making it the primary branch, and have the apex move up and off toward the left, assuming there is an appropriate branch there. Just so you know, I never feel truly comfortable making styling decisions based on pictures alone. I need to pick my way through the canopy and view the nebari and trunk line at the same time before I start chopping off branches. There is always a best front to start with, but you are the one who is most likely to see it. Dave I just took another look...that branch seems to only have needles out toward the end. If there are still some needles closer to the trunk, you will hopefully get some back budding this year with some aggressive thinning and pruning. Last edited by Dav4; 05-08-2009 at 07:51 AM..

05-08-2009, 05:55 PM	#22 (permalink)
bonsaikc What're YOU lookin' at? Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Ottawa, KS Posts: 155	When I suggested you thin it out, I did not mean removing major branches, only getting rid of some old needles and reducing branching to only two shoots per internode. You will find you get a much better idea of the tree when you can see through it. chris __________________ I am the 545th best crossword puzzle solver in the world! Sashi-no-eda Bonsai Blog

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

05-09-2009, 01:24 AM	#23 (permalink)
emorrin Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Plainfield Illinois Zone 5b Posts: 4	I find this technique you are explaining rather different then what I have seen. How long have you been growing your pines with this method? I am still trying to figure out which method is best for me. I just started really getting interested in pines last year. I have been following Steve Pilacek's techniques for Japanese Black Pines and Vance Wood for Mugo Pines. There are so many techniques, it makes my head spin... I too like to fertilize heavily with organics. I use chicken manure, fish emulsion, make my own cakes how you mentioned, use liquid seaweed, humic acid, inoculate with mycorrhizal spores, make my own compost tea, etc. I do not use any synthetic fertilizers because I believe the salts kill off the beneficial bacteria/organisms. I may be incorrect with this theory but until someone proves me wrong .... I grow in my Japanese Black Pine in a mainly inorganic mix in a pond basket. I mainly use Turface and volcanic rock with about 10% aged pine bark. I use the same mix for my Mugos. I have also started several Austrian Pine and Scotch Pines from seed this year. Enough with my rant, I am still trying to figure out which method is best for me. This will be one I will have to give a try. Do you have any additional info regarding this technique?

05-12-2009, 01:08 AM	#24 (permalink)
Ml_work Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Alabama Posts: 277	emorrin.....I hope you are not asking me...I am just the "grasshopper" in this class. Have a Great Day! Michael

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)